Friday: Hili dialogue

48 thoughts on “Friday: Hili dialogue”

1. On this day:
   1141 – The Battle of Lincoln, at which Stephen, King of England is defeated and captured by the allies of Empress Matilda.

   1536 – Spaniard Pedro de Mendoza founds Buenos Aires, Argentina.

   1653 – New Amsterdam (later renamed The City of New York) is incorporated.

   1709 – Alexander Selkirk is rescued after being shipwrecked on a desert island, inspiring Daniel Defoe’s adventure book Robinson Crusoe.

   1814 – The last of the River Thames frost fairs comes to an end.

   1887 – In Punxsutawney, Pennsylvania, the first Groundhog Day is observed.

   1899 – The Australian Premiers’ Conference held in Melbourne decides to locate Australia’s capital city, Canberra, between Sydney and Melbourne.

   1901 – Funeral of Queen Victoria.

   1913 – Grand Central Terminal opens in New York City.

   1922 – Ulysses by James Joyce is published.

   1925 – Serum run to Nome: Dog sleds reach Nome, Alaska with diphtheria serum, inspiring the Iditarod race.

   1935 – Leonarde Keeler administers polygraph tests to two murder suspects, the first time polygraph evidence was admitted in U.S. courts.

   1942 – The Osvald Group is responsible for the first, active event of anti-Nazi resistance in Norway, to protest the inauguration of Vidkun Quisling.

   1943 – World War II: The Battle of Stalingrad comes to an end when Soviet troops accept the surrender of the last organized German troops in the city.

   1959 – Nine experienced ski hikers in the northern Ural Mountains in the Soviet Union die under mysterious circumstances.

   1980 – Reports surface that the FBI is targeting allegedly corrupt Congressmen in the Abscam operation.

   1989 – Soviet–Afghan War: The last Soviet armoured column leaves Kabul.

   1990 – Apartheid: F. W. de Klerk announces the unbanning of the African National Congress and promises to release Nelson Mandela.

   2000 – First digital cinema projection in Europe (Paris) realized by Philippe Binant with the DLP CINEMA technology developed by Texas Instruments.

   2004 – Swiss tennis player Roger Federer becomes the No. 1 ranked men’s singles player, a position he will hold for a record 237 weeks.

   2005 – The Government of Canada introduces the Civil Marriage Act. This legislation would become law on July 20, 2005, legalizing same-sex marriage.

   Births:
   450 – Justin I, Byzantine emperor (d. 527).

   1585 – Judith Quiney, William Shakespeare’s youngest daughter (d. 1662).
   1585 – Hamnet Shakespeare, William Shakespeare’s only son (baptised; d. 1596).

   1650 – Nell Gwyn, English actress, mistress of King Charles II of England (d. 1687).

   1786 – Jacques Philippe Marie Binet, French mathematician, physicist, and astronomer (d. 1856).

   1861 – Solomon R. Guggenheim, American businessman and philanthropist, founded the Solomon R. Guggenheim Museum (d. 1949).

   1882 – James Joyce, Irish novelist, short story writer, and poet (d. 1941). [Ulysses was published on his birthday.]

   1883 – Johnston McCulley, American author and screenwriter, created Zorro (d. 1958).

   1883 – Julia Nava de Ruisánchez, Mexican activist and writer (d. 1964).

   1897 – Howard Deering Johnson, American businessman, founded Howard Johnson’s (d. 1972).

   1897 – Gertrude Blanch, Russian-American mathematician (d. 1996). [She did pioneering work in numerical analysis and computation. She was a leader of the Mathematical Tables Project in New York from its beginning. She worked later as the assistant director and leader of the Numerical Analysis at UCLA computing division and was head of mathematical research for the Aerospace Research Laboratory at Wright-Patterson Air Force Base in Dayton, Ohio.]

   1905 – Ayn Rand, Russian-born American novelist and philosopher (d. 1982).

   1917 – Mary Ellis, British World War II ferry pilot (d. 2018). [Today’s Woman of the Day, see next post below.]

   1923 – Liz Smith, American journalist and author (d. 2017).

   1925 – Elaine Stritch, American actress and singer (d. 2014).

   1927 – Stan Getz, American saxophonist (d. 1991).

   1927 – Doris Sams, American baseball player (d. 2012).

   1931 – Les Dawson, English comedian and author (d. 1993).

   1939 – Mary-Dell Chilton, American chemist and inventor and one of the founders of modern plant biotechnology.

   1940 – David Jason, English actor, director, and producer.

   1942 – Graham Nash, English-American singer-songwriter and guitarist.

   1947 – Farrah Fawcett, American actress and producer (d. 2009).

   1950 – Libby Purves, British journalist and author.

   1951 – Ken Bruce, Scottish radio host.

   1954 – Christie Brinkley, American actress, model, and businesswoman.

   1963 – Stephen McGann, English actor.

   1963 – Eva Cassidy, American singer and guitarist (d. 1996). [Known for her interpretations of jazz, folk, and blues music, sung with a powerful, emotive soprano voice. In 1992, she released her first album, The Other Side, a set of duets with go-go musician Chuck Brown, followed by the 1996 live solo album titled Live at Blues Alley. Although she had been honored by the Washington Area Music Association, she was virtually unknown outside her native Washington, D.C., at the time of her death from melanoma at the age of 33 in 1996. Her posthumously released recordings, including three number-one albums and one number-one single in the UK, have sold more than ten million copies. Her music has also charted within the top 10 in Australia, Germany, Norway, Sweden and Switzerland.]

   1987 – Jill Scott, English footballer.

   For some odd reason, the expression ‘death of a poet’ always sounds somewhat more concrete than ‘life of a poet.’ (Joseph Brodsky):
   1461 – Owen Tudor, Welsh founder of the Tudor dynasty (b. c. 1400). [Killed during the Battle of Mortimer’s Cross, part of the Wars of the Roses.]

   1905 – Henri Germain, French banker and politician, founded Le Crédit Lyonnais (b. 1824).

   1907 – Dmitri Mendeleev, Russian chemist and academic (b. 1834).

   1939 – Amanda McKittrick Ros, Irish author and poet (b. 1860).

   1969 – Boris Karloff, English actor (b. 1887).

   1970 – Bertrand Russell, English mathematician and philosopher, Nobel Prize laureate (b. 1872).

   1974 – Imre Lakatos, Hungarian-English mathematician and philosopher (b. 1922).

   1979 – Sid Vicious, English singer and bass player (b. 1957).

   1987 – Alistair MacLean, Scottish novelist and screenwriter (b. 1922).

   1994 – Marija Gimbutas, Lithuanian-American archeologist (b. 1921). [Known for her research into the Neolithic and Bronze Age cultures of “Old Europe” and for her Kurgan hypothesis, which located the Proto-Indo-European homeland in the Pontic Steppe.]

   1995 – Fred Perry, English tennis player (b. 1909).

   1995 – Donald Pleasence, English-French actor (b. 1919).

   1996 – Gene Kelly, American actor, singer, dancer, and director (b. 1912).

   2007 – Joe Hunter, American pianist (b. 1927). [One of the original Funk Brothers.]

   2011 – Margaret John, Welsh actress (b. 1926).

   2012 – Dorothy Gilman, American author (b. 1923).

   2014 – Philip Seymour Hoffman, American actor, director, and producer (b. 1967).

   2020 – Bernard Ebbers, Canadian businessman, the co-founder and CEO of WorldCom (b. 1941).

   2021 – Captain Sir Tom Moore, British Army officer and charity campaigner (b. 1920). [Famous for walking round his garden. But then he did raise almost £39 million for the National Health Service in the process! Sadly, his family seem to have tried to exploit his legacy for their own benefit since then.]

   2023 – Butch Miles, American jazz drummer (b. 1944).

   1. Woman of the Day
      [Text from the excellent The Attagirls X/Twitter account, appropriately since the name is taken from the nickname given to the female pilots of the Air Transport Auxiliary (ATA)]

      Woman of the Day Mary Ellis born OTD 1917 [died 24 July 2018] in Leafield, Oxfordshire, one of the last surviving Air Transport Auxiliary [ATA] pilots delivering Spitfires and bombers to RAF airfields during WW2 and one of the first women to fly the UK’s first jet fighter, the Gloster Meteor.

      Born into a farming family close to RAF bases, Mary’s father paid a flying circus to take her up in a biplane as a special treat for her 11th birthday. That was it. “It sealed my fate forever.”

      Mary started flying lessons as soon as she turned 16, achieved her pilot’s licence and flew for pleasure until the outbreak of WW2. In 1941, she heard a radio advertisement seeking female pilots to join the ATA. She became an Attagirl at the age of 24, a year after Britain allowed women to fly military aircraft but still prohibited them from combat missions.

      The decision to allow women to fly Spitfires and bombers during the war was met with widespread resistance in Britain. The farseeing editor of The Aeroplane magazine declared in 1940, “Women anxious to serve their country should take on work more befitting their sex instead of encroaching on a man’s occupation.” Mary recalled in a BBC interview: “Girls flying airplanes was almost a sin at that time.”

      Her meticulously compiled logbook said otherwise. From 1941 onwards, Mary spent over 1,100 hours flying over 1,000 planes of 56 different types including Hurricanes, Spitfires, Tempests and Wellington Bombers, from factories to RAF airfields and from the airfields to the frontline. Sometimes she delivered up to four aircraft in a day and often, she never knew until she walked out onto the tarmac which type of aircraft she was required to fly next. It didn’t matter. She could fly them all.

      Mary described flying her first Spitfire on 15 October 1942, “a date and time etched in my memory”. [I’ve omitted the extract for reasons of space but you can read it at the link at the bottom of this post.]

      Attagirls were among the first women in Britain to achieve equal pay. 168 women including volunteers from Canada, Poland, the Netherlands and the US, served in the ATA. Fifteen women ATA pilots were killed during WW2 including one who returned to duty very soon after giving birth. Make no mistake, the RAF could not have won the Battle of Britain without the vital work of the Attagirls in the fight against the Nazis.

      When WW2 ended and the ATA was disbanded, Mary was seconded to the RAF and became one of the first women to fly the UK’s first jet fighter, the Gloster Meteor.

      In 1950, Mary moved to Sandown on the Isle of Wight [IoW], managing the island’s airport, helping to introduce passenger flights to and from the IoW to Europe, becoming the first female air commandant in Europe, and setting up the flying club. She employed Vera Strodl, a sister Attagirl, as the chief flying instructor.

      Mary died in 2018 at the grand old age of 101.

      “Everybody was flabbergasted that a little girl like me could fly these big airplanes all by oneself.”

      https://twitter.com/TheAttagirls/status/1753319764519436710

      1. What a fascinating story, thank you for sharing. Love these stories about little known people who were heroes in their own way.

      2. Yes Jez, thank you. Amazing with 56 aircraft types in her logbook from fighters to bombers and even the Gloster Meteor! Sounds like many of her flight hours were busy ones in take offs and landings. Lived to a ripe old age and always around airplanes. Nice story.

      3. Thanks for your kind words.

   2. Thank you, thank you for leading me to Eva Cassidy.

      1. You’re very welcome. Her cover version of Sting’s “Fields of Gold” is excellent.

   3. 1141 – The Battle of Lincoln, at which Stephen, King of England is defeated and captured by the allies of Empress Matilda.

      That was a comprehensively murky part of history. IIRC, the war between the two factions went on for 6 or 8 years, since both had strong claims to the throne they wanted to inherit from their father ; I forget if they were full- or half- siblings ; at least one was captured then released by the forces of the other, and maybe more than once (like I said, “murky”).
      George RR Martin cited the Wars of the Roses and Hadrian’s Wall as inspiration for the “Game of Thrones”/ “Tale of Fire and Ice” heptology (? 7 volumes, wasn’t it?), but Maude and Stephen must have come into his researches on more than a few occasions. A fine example of royalty as bloodthirsty internecine warfare – no wonder King Big Ears the Third and “the Firm” want to bury it in the past.

      1709 – Alexander Selkirk is rescued after being shipwrecked on a desert island, inspiring Daniel Defoe’s adventure book Robinson Crusoe.

      IIRC, Selkirk was marooned (put ashore at his own request, with stores) because he did not wish to serve under the vessel’s captain, not “shipwrecked”. That was Defoe’s invention, from whole cloth. I’m not sure if the “Robinson Crusoe” story was based on Selkirk’s first, or second marooning. That bit didn’t make it through the edit either.

      1935 – Leonarde Keeler administers polygraph tests to two murder suspects, the first time polygraph evidence was admitted in U.S. courts.

      A technique which has never, TTBOMK, been accepted as having enough experimental validification to be accepted by the British courts. Not even in Diplock (no-jury) trials. Worth remembering whenever it turns up in the movies.

      Captain Sir Tom Moore […] Sadly, his family seem to have tried to exploit his legacy for their own benefit since then.

      They seem to be trying to manoeuvre the “court of public opinion” to consider the question of “What would granddad have wanted?” when the question before the courts is “What are the regulations of the Charities Commission, and did they follow them?” I don’t think their stratagem is working.

2. There are those that look down on Tater Tots, but they are yet another pretty-good way to have potatoes. Many recipes that attempt to make them a main dish look to be a Terrible Mistake, but we enjoy simply baking them on a flat pan under shredded cheddar cheese, salsa, bacon bits, and diced green onions. Serve with sour cream. I forget what it’s called.

   1. Delicious?

   2. Cheesy-bacon-tots? Hotdish? But I’ll go with j a h, above…

      My favorite brand is Alexia, who call them Potato-Puffs.

   3. As a Brit, I only heard about Tater Tots courtesy of Friends.

3. Pfft Punxsutawney Phil! We in the Midwest look to Woodstock Willie, who prognosticated an early spring.(Woodstock, Illinois, was the location for the movie, Groundhog Day.)
   https://wgntv.com/celebratingskilling/tom-skilling-visits-woodstock-for-groundhog-day-celebration/

4. The Elmo post is in response to Elmo, on ‘his’ post, asking people if everybody is ok. It’s become a ‘viral thing’ in the last few days, with replies from ‘thanks for asking’ to many crude responses.

   1. Thanks for giving context. I wonder if the person sending the item in knew or was a victim of right-wing propaganda?

   2. And not only crude responses, but some that were quite despairing and sad, which is why this became a “thing” online. While Biden’s response comes across as a little ham-handed to me, there is at least a sense of caring and playing along with the idea of “we’re all in this together.” I cannot begin to imagine how Trump would have responded to Elmo’s inquiry, had it ever been on his or his handlers’ radar to respond to such a thing.

      1. I cannot begin to imagine how Trump would have responded to Elmo’s inquiry

         If there were ever a way of knowing, I’d put the price of a pint on his response being “Elmo who?”

   3. I find it strange that PCC(E)’s friend would see this as a sign of dementia, even if they didn’t know the context. Seriously? Sending a positive message = dementia?

      1. Furthermore, I doubt that Biden actually writes his tweets. I assume they’re handled by a social media team, to avoid what happened the last time a President was in charge of tweeting.

         1. Good point.

5. Dear Professor Coyne.
   Sorry to read your report that you are not feeling well. I hope you recover soon.
   Regards.

6. Can someone please explain why the U.S. Naval Observatory sign has “a wee spelling mistake?”

   1. There’s no spelling mistake on the sign. The joke is in imagining that the place is not a “naval observatory” but instead a “navel observatory.”

   2. It’s an “omph”[alos] moment?

7. The checkiday site linked to for days for years has been very sloppy. The Heavenly Hash page refers to a “delicious dessert” but is illustrated with a picture of a coarse meat hash https://static.checkiday.com/img/1200/Corn-beef-hash.avif [They also confuse “macarons” and “macaroons” https://www.checkiday.com/cd9c204befb4c2c9cf38d6d943144fe6/national-chocolate-macaroon-day which was pointed out to them some time ago and never corrected.] Surely there are better sites?

   Lagniappe: Of course the real Heavenly Hash is a confection made of almonds and marshmallows encased in chocolate (as made by my aunt) or not-very-reasonable facsimile candy bar made by Elmer’s of Ponchatoula, LA https://imgur.com/a/f41UwGo

   1. Yes, I’m aware of that. If there is a better site with daily “remembrances,” please send me the link. Thank.

8. The checkiday site linked to for days for years has been very sloppy. The Heavenly Hash page refers to a “delicious dessert” but is illustrated with a picture of a coarse meat hash [They also confuse “macarons” and “macaroons” which was pointed out to them some time ago and never corrected.] Surely there are better sites?
   Lagniappe: Of course the real Heavenly Hash is a confection made of almonds and marshmallows encased in chocolate (as made by my aunt) or not-very-reasonable facsimile candy bar made by Elmer’s of Ponchatoula, LA https://imgur.com/a/f41UwGo
   [abbreviated to avoid getting lost in limbo of moderation]

9. It’s good that the squad’s positions against Israel are being called out.

   Yes. The proposals to reduce the distribution of humanitarian aid temporarily in Gaza will be vilified by the press—and perhaps the proposals were ill-advised given the tenor of public opinion. But with Hamas allegedly hijacking half of all aid going into Gaza for its own use, it does make sense for Israel to take over the distribution on its own. I would rather see a Palestinian aid agency distribute the aid, but there may not be any such agency in a position to do the job.

   The galleys of the Washington State Ferry System serve Tater Tots (or a generic equivalent). When we took the ferries regularly, we would get an order as soon as we got on the boat. With ketchup or mustard, they’re awesome—so long as they are crispy and not soggy. (Sometimes they get a bit soggy when they’ve been sitting around under the heat lamp.)

   1. I’ve never been much of a political donor at all but I’ve been motivated lately to finance people who can primary or defeat the Squad. Particularly Omar and AOC.

      I have money that I no longer give to the ACLU, Planned Parenthood (b/c of genderwang, I’m not paying for damaging sex changes for autistic teens), etc.
      I’ve watched the growth of Rapid Onset Gender Dysphoria since 2017 and began researching the whole thing then and now have an actual dog in the fight. I didn’t finish med school at uni (just a year) but it gave me a start to read about medicine as a hobby for the next 30 years so I came at the subject not as a clinician or scientist but rather just a well informed tourist. And I was horrified.

      D.A.
      NYC

      1. Thank you for that perspective David. I didn’t know that.

10. I’m glad to celebrate groundhogs today, since I’ve become a huge fan lately – thanks in large part to gifs like this one:

    https://imgur.com/gallery/K2pESSy

11. I thought I had seen that UNRWA cartoon in the Post, but could not find it when I went back to look. But I did stumble on this UNRWA/terrorists WaPo cartoon:
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2024/01/29/michael-ramirez-cartoon-unrwa-hamas-october-7/

    1. Excellent cartoon!

12. The video of Clapton and McCartney is from the “Concert for George” held a year after his death. It is fantastic and I highly recommend people view (and listen to) the video.

    The lineup for the concert is pretty amazing. And it was good timing, I would say. Some of the people probably can’t perform nearly as well now (12 years later).

    One stand-out for me was: Joe Brown and his ukulele.

    Also: Just watching these great musicians playing together.

    1. Yes! Will we ever see another generation of such musicians?

13. This whole accepted idea of “Occupied” West Bank is a fiction – there is an excellent argument that even when not officially annexed, the West Bank is legally Israeli owned full stop. (Elder of Ziyon posted it awhile back, I’ll try to find it again. Written by a lawyer who writes about politics above my lowly pay grade).

    And they’d be insane to ever give it up given it OVERLOOKS the narrow strip that is pre 67 Israel, an unacceptable strategic position for a murderous sharia state whose entire mythos is the annihilation of Israel. Oh yeah, a bristling with arms and empowered “second state” right up against and above the Israeli jugular. Seems legit.
    Gimme a break: No country – none – would put such a gun in the hands of an enemy who almost never shuts up about wanting to kill it. Would YOU?

    Trouble is calling it “Judea and Samaria” has the ring of haredi extremism, of the ultra orthodox we in NYC refer to (sort of) affectionately as “hats”. But names aside, the “West Bank” must always be under Israeli control.

    Or Israel would “beat the clock” – the big, lit countdown to 2040 clock in Palestine Square, Tehran. It is the countdown to Israel being wiped off that map. Tick-tick-tick.

    D.A.
    NYC
    https://whyevolutionistrue.com/2020/06/10/photos-of-readers-93/
    posted here previously: https://themoderatevoice.com/the-suicidal-stupidity-of-a-two-state-solution/

    1. Perhaps this?:

       https://elderofziyon.blogspot.com/2012/01/eugene-kontorovichs-talk-at-nyu-on.html

       1. Yes thanks I think that’s it. I’ll look into it.
          D.A.
          NYC

14. The Oct 9 statement from Rep. Ocasia-Cortez displays the vacuity we have come to expect of the Left. (Not just her. It is our government’s official policy.) She condemns the actions of Hamas in the strongest possible terms and then segues immediately into a call for a ceasefire. (I checked the link. The quoted passage appears in full, right from her office. No sloppy newspaper typist has left out intervening passages that would give it any logical sense.)

    She seems to think that condemning the actions of Hamas is all she needs to do to get them to stop —“There. That’ll show ‘em!”—so she can go back to trashing Israel. But she’s not stupid. She must know that her words mean literally nothing, not least because Hamas knows that she and her supporters are on their side. She doesn’t want to admit that the way good guys stop bad guys with guns is by invading their territory and killing them. With guns. Because if she admitted that, the good guys might win.

15. I hope you feel better soon, Jerry. I was under the weather a couple weeks ago, and since have had this nagging cough…bugs are going around. I was also negative for Covid.

16. From the executive order imposing sanctions on Israeli settlers:

    “These actions undermine the foreign policy objectives of the United States, including the viability of a two-state solution and ensuring Israelis and Palestinians can attain equal measures of security, prosperity, and freedom. . . . For these reasons, these actions constitute an unusual and extraordinary threat to the national security and foreign policy of the United States. I hereby declare a national emergency to deal with that threat.”

    An “extraordinary threat” to US national security. Yes, indeed, it is a “national emergency” for the United States. Surely any reasonable person can see that. You want to exercise power that you otherwise don’t have? Want to send a signal to your voters? Just declare a national emergency. And then extend that “emergency” for years. If the policy is “the viability of a two-state solution” and ensuring equal measures of prosperity for Palestinians, then you will certainly have an “emergency” for years. And the next party in office will have a different “emergency.”

    https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/presidential-actions/2024/02/01/executive-order-on-imposing-certain-sanctions-on-persons-undermining-peace-security-and-stability-in-the-west-bank/

17. I like Matt Gaetz’s comment on the Cori Bush investigation. He said, “Call me old fashioned, but I think a man should protect his wife for free.”

18. “When Rep. Rashida Tlaib (D-Mich.) was under fire for defending calls for genocide against Jewish people…”

    Jerry, I love your science, but this is a bad faith interpretation of “River to the Sea”– used originally and now by Tlaib to describe the desire to have a multi-ethnic, multi-religious secular democracy from the Jordan River to the Mediterranean (i.e., one-state solution). She has repeatedly described this vision of peace for the region, but has been repeatedly accused– without evidence– of advocating for genocide. In my opinion these are either misreadings of the statement, or willful misunderstandings. For example, when Bibi displays a map of “greater Israel”– which encompasses, Israel, Palestine, and Golan heights at UN General Assembly in New York City, he is given the benefit of the doubt.
    I’m going to stop commenting on your posts related to Israel/Palestine, because I clearly have a different point of view than most of your audience and don’t wish to spam.

    1. Sorry, but Tlaib (who voted the other day not to exclude known members of Hamas from coming to America) is clearly an antisemite, and I don’t give her the benefit of the doubt. She’s shown her hand many times, including having a map in her office in which “Israel” doesn’t exist and is subsumed into “Palestine”. And yes, a one-state solution that incorporates Israel into a Palestinian state will result in genocide, or else in somehow forcing all Israeli Jews to move elsewhere. You know that because Hamas has said it wants to kill all the Jews and the PA fosters terrorism. When Tlaib says this isan “aspiration,” what do you think she means? That she wants Jews and Palestinians to live in one state in peace? Sorry, but only a fool would think that possible. It is impossible for Tlaib to be politically viable if she gives the “river to the sea” interpretation that most Palestinians have, and which is undoubtedly hers.

       I’d be curious about how you think a “one state solution” would bring peace now? Do you REALLY think that?

       For your information, I don’t know about Bibi’s display of a map of “greater Israel”, but I wouldn’t approve of that, either, so I didn’t give him “the benefit of the doubt”, and if you were implying that I had done that, you really should apologize.

19. 1)This bill was performative:
    “This bill is widely duplicative of current law, as Hamas has been designed as a terrorist organization by the State Department since 1997, and any noncitizen who has engaged in or provided material support for terrorism is in admissible to the United States,” a notice from House Minority Whip Katherine Clark (D-MA) stated.
    2)The “map” was actually on a T-shirt, and again, harkens to the one-state proposal.
    3) The arguments that Palestinians and Israeli Jews cannot live together, as the Jews will be massacred, is disturbingly reminiscent of the arguments promulgated by white south africans towards the end of apartheid. The statements comes from a place that is deeply fatalistic, and denies the reality that situations can change, especially when justice is the goal and material needs of people are met.
    4) I would never accuse you of being a Bibi apologist. I used the passive voice in my statement that he “is given”, not that you give him.

    Here is the link to bibi’s map of greater Israel (https://www.jpost.com/israel-news/politics-and-diplomacy/article-760189). We also don’t need to litigate this on the blog, if you don’t want– I’m not looking to be adversarial.

    1. You quoted the only critic in the House who said something against the bill (though she didnt vote against it!) and if it’s performative, why vote against it? If it duplicates another good bill, why vote “no”. And why Tlaib?

       The map is in her office and is not on a tee-shirt. See here: https://www.newarab.com/news/congresswoman-rashida-tlaib-puts-palestine-map-literally.

       The only way, given history, that Jews and Muslims can live together without Mulsims trying to kill the Jews or treat them as second-class citizens if if the Muslims aren’t religious. For in the 1400 years since Islam was founded, they have either tried to kill Jews or, if they lived in one state, the Jews were forced to be second-class citizens–dhimmis. And when the regime changed, they could be killed or expelled. I know of no exceptions. So your dream of a state in which Jews and Muslims live together in the Middle East is pure wish thinking.

       I needn’t address Bibi, and of course you are being adversarial, as am I! But this discussion has reached its end.

20. There is a petition in NZ to cancel Ziggy Marley’s appearance at the 2024 WomaDeliade. Why? he supports The Israeli position and condemns Hamas. He also did a fundraiser for the IDF.
    I read comments from some of the signees… throwing myself at a brick wall seemed more inviting after the first few.

21. Yes, PPC(E). Every single place where Jews have tried to live within Arab majorities it has ended badly for the Jews.

    There’s a fantasy about a pre-1948 kumbaya in the Islamosphere.
    Here, let me disabuse you of this dream with some pre-48 facts.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisemitism_in_the_Arab_world#:~:text=While%20Arab%20antisemitism%20has%20increased,and%20Libya%20in%20the%201940s

    The idea of a dual state flies against all reason and an example of westerners projecting their own values on a deeply different civilization. Not “just like us.”

    In 1990 starting my BA at Melbourne Uni in psych and Middle East politics I was quite pro-Palestine (with some reservations). Graduate study of M.E. Pol. in the US, 30 years of reading, travel and studying Arabic (albeit to a not-excellent level) has moved me far, far in the other direction. The deeper you read, listen and experience the greater the horror of the “Palestinian dream” looks. And the worse Islam looks, btw.

    D.A.
    NYC

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