Music to my ears, this headline. Click to read:
The search was unannounced, and apparently involved looking for classified documents that may have been removed from the White House. The FBI even broke into a safe, a sign that it’s dead serious. As the NYT notes:
The F.B.I. would have needed to convince a judge that it had probable cause that a crime had been committed, and that agents might find evidence at Mar-a-Lago, to get a search warrant. Proceeding with a search on a former president’s home would almost surely have required sign-off from top officials at the bureau and the Justice Department.
The search, however, does not mean prosecutors have determined that Mr. Trump committed a crime.
An F.B.I. representative declined to comment, as did Justice Department officials. The F.B.I. director, Christopher A. Wray, was appointed by Mr. Trump.
. . . Aides to President Biden said they were stunned by the development and learned of it from Twitter.
I wonder what crime they’re investigating.
The Republicans are furious; look at this petulant threat, worthy of a five year old:
Mr. Trump has long cast the F.B.I. as a tool of Democrats who have been out to get him, and the search set off a furious reaction among his supporters in the Republican Party and on the far right of American politics. Representative Kevin McCarthy of California, the Republican leader in the House, suggested that he intended to investigate Attorney General Merrick B. Garland if Republicans took control of the House in November.
The Orange Man is inching ever closer to donning an orange suit.
I’m loving this, but I’m not loving the commentary about it. Yes, the fact that Trump’s residence was the subject of a search warrant is big news and implies probable cause for a crime. But the commentary on CNN and MSNBC last night was more exuberant than the facts warrant. One commentator said that we should wait and see what the warrant says, but nonetheless went on in the very same sentence to speculate about the crimes that might have been committed.
I do hope they nail the Orange guy, but rather than engage in endless speculation, why aren’t reporters working day and night to get their hands on the text of the warrant? Maybe they are. That’s what I really want to read.
“… but rather than engage in endless speculation, why aren’t reporters (also) working day and night to get their hands on …” Hunter’s Laptop?
Because there is probably no there there. Remind the ‘Benghazi’ hearings?
A copy of a federal search warrant is left at the place searched (and will, presumably, become public knowledge in short order).
On the other hand, the sworn affidavit by a law enforcement officer submitted in support of the search warrant application — viz., the document that sets out facts sufficient to establish probable cause to believe that a crime has been committed and that evidence of that crime will be found in the location to be searched — is ordered sealed by the federal judge or magistrate who signed the warrant. It will not become public until that judge or magistrate orders it unsealed.
The procedures regarding federal search warrants are set out in Federal Rule of Criminal Procedure 41.
From what I’ve been reading in the frothing mad and mostly insane reactions among GOP politicians – they uniformly ignore the idea that Trump may have actually done something illegal.
They simply go on about how you don’t investigate former presidents!
Basically they are putting Trump as above the law, and loudly complaining that treating everyone equal under the law is a dystopian threat.
Even worse: they excoriate this as an instance of The Worst Possible Thing a government can do – turning the law on political opponents, and in the next breath: “And I promise to do JUST THAT THING – investigate teams of democrats – if you elect me!”
It’s mind boggling.
Jeez, I’m old enough to remember 2016 when Donald Trump and his minions (such as Michael Flynn and Rudy Giuliani) led the crowds at his campaign rallies on chants of “Lock Her Up!” because Hillary Clinton had some classified documents on a private email server at her home. The FBI’s investigation of that server, and FBI director James Comey’s press conference announcing that Clinton wouldn’t be charged — and, most especially, Comey’s announcement 10 days before the 2016 election that the investigation had been reopened because some of Clinton’s emails (ones, as it turns out, the FBI had long had in its possession) had been found on the laptop computer belonging to Huma Abedin and used by her husband Anthony Weiner — very likely cost Clinton the 2016 presidential election.
I’m also old enough to remember when Donald Trump tried to pull the ultimate snow job — the gaslighting di tutti gaslighting — by claiming that he’d fired FBI director Comey because Comey had been so unfair to poor Hillary during the 2016 campaign.
As for all the pissing & moaning Trump and his MAGA Republicans are doing in response to the execution of the search warrant, they ought to keep in mind how dangerous it is to bet into another poker player’s hand when you have no idea what he or she is holding in their hole cards.
I remember exactly where I was when APR announced over the radio that Comey said (to the effect) the FBI were opening more investigations into Clinton’s emails. My heart sunk; it being so close to the election, and knowing her polls were slipping, I felt Comey knifed her in the back. I find it very unsettling that in his auto-biography, he was shocked and mortified that people blamed him for this “political” attack. He either knew exactly what he was doing, or lacks the wherewithal to be the FBI director. And if it was the former, then the latter holds true as well.
“[W]hy aren’t reporters working day and night to get their hands on the text of the warrant?” As a retired journalist, I assure you they are. Why would you assume otherwise? There are Pulitzers to be won here. Also, it’s their job.
The National Archives had previously recovered documents at Mar-a-Lago that were marked as classified, and Trump should not be in possession of them at this time. This search (which was done carefully and with fore-knowledge of the Secret Service who are with Trump) was to see if there were any more.
I am a bit confused. I thought the president has the power to classify and declassify documents. All Trump has to say is that he declassified the documents before removing them. What am I missing?
This is speculation, but I would assume that there would be a process to go through that documents the classification/declassification at the time. If there is no evidence that Trump declassified a document that he now is in possession of while he was still president, then he is in trouble.
I think there has to be some record of that declaration: he can’t just wave his hands over them and say, “Now you are declassified.”
You mean all Trump has to do is lie, with no evidence to back it up, about having declassified the documents while he was still president? (Trump lost all authority to order documents declassified the moment Joe Biden took the oath of office; Trump has no authority to declassify documents now nunc pro tunc to his days as president.) We all know The Donald would never dissimulate like that.
In any event, your comment presupposes that the only relevance of the documents to the commission of a crime is that they are classified. That may not be the case.
Moreover, all documents generated during Trump’s presidency belong to the National Archives (and, hence, to the American people), not merely classified documents.
Indeed, Mr Trump is not president anymore. He has no say about any document. But the chewed and eaten documents are probably lost.
But it is good the FBI investigates what is still left.
German news reports say the search occurred because Trump took materials from Washington to Palm Beach after the end of his presidency in January 2021, when they should have been turned over to the National Archives.
I hope the FBI checked the toilets; I hear he likes to get rid of documents that way. What a freak!
Trump will never be donning an orange suit. Whatever the crimes for which he may be indicted and then convicted (assuming a steadfast and principled jury), no judge will sentence an ex-president to serve time in a federal prison. Instead, he will be held under house arrest and electronically monitored, probably in New York, where his coiffure may be tended and his Big Macs delivered.
You maybe right, but why do you think that? Why would no judge sentence him to serve time if he deserves it?
And I’m afraid the Orange One is loving every minute of it. Nothing could provide him with more red meat to throw to his adulants than more “evidence” that he’s being persecuted by the corrupt deep state. It’s a populist’s dream. It will almost certainly help him with the Republican base.
Whether he is then able to turn that into a general election win in 2024 will largely depend on how weak, ineffective and unpopular Biden is or is made to seem by that time, assuming he runs. If not, one can only hope that some Democratic candidate is able to inspire against a less than rosy backdrop.
Somehow I find it hard to believe that Tr*mp will ever be able to win over enough of the centrists and independents to yield a win. But oh how wrong we’ve been on that one before.
Yes, Democrats should pause and think before singing Oh, frabjous day with such enthusiasm. I would guess most normals perceive this as the persecution of a political enemy, the weaponization of the DOJ and the terrible precedent that it is, just as they perceive the J6 show trial. It is everything that the right wing commentators repeat in unison and should embarrass the dwindling number of classical liberals left in the Democratic party. TPTB will have succeeded in unifying and galvanizing the Republican base quite nicely. Well played!
Persecution?
1) The FBI Director is a Trump appointee
2) Trump was previously found to be in illegal possession of White House documents
3) The judge who signed the warrant found probable cause to approve it
1) And? Trump is notorious for poor personnel picks.
2) If Trump broke the law, do you really think in this climate he would not have been charged?
3) Remember “how hard it is to get a FISA surveillance warrant, and how the very fact The Regime secured one against Trump proves that the evidence against him is bountiful, robust, and impeccable?”~ace Haven’t we heard this before?
Anyhoo, talking about perception. Horrible optics, everything else aside.
Yes Bunny, as he noted himself, he can get away with murder,.
Trump is indeed notorious for poor pics, for choosing people that pay fealty to him rather than the Constitution or the rule of law, but in case of Mr Wren we can obviously forget about that.
I think he will be charged. Mr Garland is just very meticulous, he doesn’t want to be accused of revenge (he will be anyway).
I think it is time Putin’s poodle gets his just deserts,
By normals I’m guessing you mean everyone except those at the extreme ends of the spectrum? If so your guess is not supported by polling. Rather the opposite. A wide variety of polling has shown that there has been significant movement away from Trump as the Jan. 6 hearings have occurred, even among Republican respondents.
I often wonder what people that criticize any resistance to Trump and his underlings as self defeating propose should be done instead. Typically this criticism comes from people that think “both sides” are comparably corrupt, and often straight up Trump apologists. Should nothing be done when people at the highest levels have subverted parts of the federal government, attempted to subvert presidential election results and committed crimes? Or, don’t you believe these things have happened? Is it just fake news?
I really think it’s about damn time politicians are held accountable to the rule of law. Well past time actually. Probably too late in fact.
Polls shmolls. Remember 2016?
“Should nothing be done when people at the highest levels have subverted parts of the federal government, attempted to subvert presidential election results and committed crimes? Or, don’t you believe these things have happened? Is it just fake news?”
Oh, these things do indeed happen and yes, on both sides.
“Remember 2016?”
Yes, and more so, I’ve read a lot of follow up analysis. If you do a little research, you’ll find that the polls then (as today) are really pretty accurate. It’s a misconception, largely fueled by the media, that the 2016 polls were somehow egregiously incorrect or flawed.
“Oh, these things do indeed happen and yes, on both sides.”
This is such a ridiculous and flippant statement, in response to darrelle’s serious question, I don’t want to debase myself rebuking it.
That the polls were incorrect, whether by a lot or a little, is a true statement.
https://www.npr.org/2016/11/14/502014643/4-possible-reasons-the-polls-got-it-so-wrong-this-year
https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2016/11/09/why-2016-election-polls-missed-their-mark/
https://www.forbes.com/sites/startswithabang/2016/11/09/the-science-of-error-how-polling-botched-the-2016-election/?sh=899a3f437959
That people at the highest levels, of all political persuasions, commit crimes and are not always held accountable is a true statement and nothing new.
I should hope most “normals” would want to know what the facts are before making up they’re minds on such an important matter.
Of course, such normality (or any respect for norms, or respect for facts, for that matter) has never been the strong suit of Trump supporters.
The problem is you DO NOT have really a separate independent judiciary, no matter what is claimed. Any post that is subject to vote, is effectively a beauty contest.
Jeez, Bunny, wasn’t that terrible precedent set two years ago, just 26 days before the 2020 presidential election, when Donald Trump — publicly, IN ALL CAPS, with exclamation points — demanded that his attorney general, William Barr, indict Trump’s opponent, Joe Biden?
Guess from some people nothing counts as “terrible” when Donald Trump does it, huh?
Sorry, I’m not a Trump apologist. I will say his results were much better than Joe Biden’s, though.
Did you ever call out Donald Trump in any public forum for “weaponizing” the Justice Department in 2020, Bunny — either when he called upon his AG to indict Joe Biden ahead of the election or, after the election, when he importuned his acting AG, Jeffrey Rosen, to “just say the election was corrupt,” even though Rosen, Barr, and many others had assured him there was no evidence to support such an allegation?
If not, why not? And why now instead?
Whose home was raided by the FBI during the Trump administration? And I thought our host was averse to these long, contentious back-and-forths? You can have the last word, I’m done.
“Whose home was raided by the FBI during the Trump administration?”
Beyond irrelevant.
“And I thought our host was averse to these long, contentious back-and-forths?”
You started it and kept it going…look above for proof.
“You can have the last word, I’m done.”
LOL, thanks for the laugh! You realize yours was the last word, right? Ahem, I’ll take it from you, and add:
I’m done with your Bunnyfoolery.
“Sorry, I’m not a Trump apologist.” You could have fooled me there.
What do you mean? Which of his ‘results’ were much better than Joe Biden’s, pray?
Republican House minority leader, Kevin McCarthy, has already threatened Attorney General Merrick Garland with endless investigations should the Republicans regain the House. This is all the Republicans will do — investigate everything and find nothing. Serious legislation will not even be considered.
https://thehill.com/policy/national-security/3593582-mccarthy-threatens-to-probe-garland-after-trump-fbi-raid/
Kevin McCarthy is the most spineless, maladroit politician ever to aspire to the house speakership (at least within the memory of anyone alive today), and that includes known pedophile and felon Denny Hastert, the former Republican speaker from Illinois.
Even assuming Republicans gain control of the House in the midterms, I’m not 100% convinced that McCarthy will ascend to the speakership (or, if he does, that he will remain there). Just as McCarthy has no core, he has no core constituency within the wingnut Republican house caucus.
A relevant Classical comment from our friends at Sententiae Antiquae: https://sententiaeantiquae.com/2022/08/09/just-think-about-the-rise-and-fall-of-the-roman-republic/
“civilizations wax and wane…”
And ours is waning. What will take its place, another Dark Ages or a new Enlightenment? If I had to bet, I’d put my money on the former. But I’ll be damned if I let things turn out as if I were betting on them!
There is a danger with doomism of making such outcomes more possible, rather than “sleep walking into a crisis” it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. See the climate crisis for a definition of doomism.
Please reread my comment. I’m not succumbing to nor nourishing doomism. A sober view of present-day humanity reveals us on the fence between liberalism and authoritarianism, leaning toward the authoritarian side. I said I’ll be damned if I let the Dark Ages come about, meaning that I’m doing my damnedest to ensure that the Enlightenment continues.
More bad news for Trump
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-08-09/trump-s-tax-returns-can-be-released-to-congress-court-rules
I want to see Trump in prison as much as the next sane person, irrespective of political affiliation. Unfortunately, the consequences of that would be significant violence. Trump’s supporters are never going to believe anything negative about the man, despite massive evidence. They will see any prosecution as persecution, and they’ll take it personally.
I see this getting very ugly before it gets better.
>> Trump’s supporters are never going to believe anything negative about the man… <<
Stereotype much? I'm a Trump supporter, and of course there are negative aspects to the man (as there are to all men). That doesn't mean he wasn't the best President we've had in my lifetime.
You forgot to add… “despite massive evidence” to the quote, which is pertinent IMO.
In the interest of self-education, I’m going to swallow my bile and ask “Why?”
I thought it might have been GG was only 6-years-old, and so didn’t have many presidents to choose from. Then I’d argue Trump was the second best POTUS in this 6-year-old’s lifetime, but let’s not get ahead of ourselves. GG’s writing is noticeably above the average 6-year-olds’, so I’m stumped like the reasonable among us should be. My second guess: he/she/it is a Corporation, or very, very rich. That constituency is in LOVE with Trump. Explains a lot. Weird people, those corporations and billionaires. I’m sure religion is mixed in there too, somehow…just a hunch.
Quick question, Gideon: Do you believe Donald Trump’s claim that he won a huge, landslide victory in the 2020 presidential election that was stolen from him through massive voter fraud?
We are living in a banana republic — and I’m not sure sure about the republic part.
Do banana republics usually require steps authorized by stringent, independent levels of the judicial and investigation systems before authorizing a search like this?
Or do they tend to arise when strong men and capitulating politicians hollow out the justice system “defund the FBI etc” so as to reduce oversight and obstruction to getting their way in targeting their political enemies? (As GOPs are already calling for).
The first is where we are now. The second is what it would look like of Trump were elected again (and he tried it the first time – the only reason he failed was that the USA is not, thankfully, a Banana Republic).
Stop making excuses based on fabricated versions of the USA to imply what Trump did (and would do) is hunky dory for the country.