Denyse O’Leary fail

August 8, 2011 • 7:56 am

If I had to defend myself against all the religious loons who go after me on the internet, I’d never get my day job done.  And one of the most prominent wackos, Denyse O’Leary of Uncommon Descent, has just gone after me for criticizing Texas Governor Rick Perry’s big prayer rally.  Fortunately, I have good allies like Ed Brayton, who saves me trouble by defending me against O’Leary’s nonsense.

In his latest post at Dispatches from the Culture Wars, Brayton points out that O’Leary uses counterevidence from the wrong country (Canada), wrongly claims that Muslims are turning America’s schools into sharia schools, and then gets the First Amendment completely wrong.

I appreciate Ed’s support, but wonder if someone as inconsequential and mush-brained as O’Leary is really worth bothering with.

20 thoughts on “Denyse O’Leary fail”

      1. She embarrasses me as a Canadian. Comparing 1st amendment issues to situations in Canada is nuts. Not only are we different countries, but Canada doesn’t HAVE any sort of separation of Church and State (the whole Queen of Canada thing being the Head of the Church of England and all).

        Besides, from what I gather her hyperbole of “sharia” schools in Toronto is just plain wrong. One school ( or maybe more than one) are letting Muslim students use the school Cafeteria for their prayers instead of them cutting out of class to go pray at a nearby mosque.

        1. Although they are segregating the male from the female students (guess where the female students get to sit) and menstruating females are forced to site at the back and are not allowed to participate.

          This is in the school cafeteria during school hours in the nominally secular Ontario public school system.

          Let’s imagine a similar scenario where gay students are not allowed to participate equally in the full range of activities offered by the school. Well we don’t have to imagine, the publicly funded Ontario Catholic school system does exactly this (is anybody surprised ?).

          Muslims reasonably ask, well if Catholics are allowed to project their religio-pathic bigotry into the public sphere at the taxpayers’ expense then why can we ?

          1. The details (eg. sex segregation) of the Muslim prayer sessions are problematic, and the event itself is arguably a grey area (though I’m inclined to say it should be permitted, all else being equal). However, describing it as a “Sharia school” is typical over-the-top wingnut alarmism.

          2. Interesting article in the Saturday edition of the Toronto Star, apparently Coptic catlicks are upset that the (publicly funded) Ontario Catholic school system isn’t being bigoted enough as they are considering finally allowing gay catholic students to form LGBT associations, so the Coptics are threatening to pull out of the Catholic school system and start sending their children to private schools to be indoctrinated.

            Perhaps the Catholic school board could allow the Coptics the use of the school cafeteria where they could exclude gay students, but only when the cafeteria is otherwise not being used. Say just after the Muslims have finished with it.

            All things being equal, of course.

            Best part of the article:

            Attaalla denied his congregation was being discriminatory.

            “As Christ said, everyone is welcome to sit at my father’s table,” Attaalla said. “So we don’t discriminate, we just don’t believe in homosexuality.”

  3. I’m on the fence. In an ideal world, kooks like O’Leary would be dismissed and ignored by anyone with a pair of brain cells to rub together.

    Sadly, this is far from an ideal world, and people peddling “mush-brained nonsense” get far more attention and credibility than they deserve. I think it’s a good idea to point out their lapses in logic, and correct their errors. (All the better if someone will do it on your behalf.)

    Would it be fair to say that people like this equate a lack of opposition to their claims as proof that they’re correct?

  4. I heard someone mention it lately…

    It is time to take to the streets, like the 1960s and take back the country from the mush-brained and anti-science morans and the religious right who are trying to make the country a theocracy.

    I, for one, am fed up with the ignorant, arrogant, racist, misogynistic, fascist tea party types.

    Hundreds of peaceful but vocal protests in cities all over the country can be used to show how pissed off we are by that minority who are ruining the economy and civil discourse.

    1. Absolutely! Bonus – if the sophisticated christians don’t support it, we can put their brainwash to rest as well.

    2. I’m increasingly pessimistic. They may be a minority, but they just might be a plurality.

      1. Therefore a good reason to get out there, vocalize and show the normal people how abnormal those people act and a path to reason.

  5. Even if the discussion were about Canada she would still be deeply confused. Toronto schools allowing students to use the empty cafeteria for prayers somehow becomes, in O’Leary’s mind, mandatory attendance at sharia schools.

  6. “I appreciate Ed’s support, but wonder if someone as inconsequential and mush-brained as O’Leary is really worth bothering with.”

    It would likely be valuable from time to time, since Converts’ Corner witness the value of meeting evidence conflicting beliefs is. (I think.) And we know that clearly making a stand, however the context, makes for an impression. (Re Rosenhause.)

    The trick is to do it while not bloviating the impression of value in anti-science belief. A curt and decisive dismissal like this one seems to suit.

  7. As I learned from watching Monty Python, it’s not an efficient use of your time learning how to defend yourself against an attacker holding a banana.

  9. I’m glad you linked to Ed’s old site, ’cause the new one is down again. 🙁

    Someone needs to call her on her BS. Of course, she’ll find some reason that Brayton is totally wrong.

  10. Uncommon Descent used to be William Dembski’s own web site, then he invited Denyse O’Leary to tag along. For the last year or so, Dembski has all but disappeared from the scene, and O’Leary is really responsible for most of the posts (often disguised as “News”, although frequently there’s nothing “new” about any of the “News” items).

    So in many ways, other than the Discovery Institute’s own web site, she’s become one of the primary spokespersons for ID.

    I try not to read her posts too much anymore – they are so sneering and snarky that it makes for depressing reading. For a self-regarded science writer, she certainly seems to hate science most of the time. Of course it would be one thing if the “news” posts are actually about news relating to ID, but they are nearly all articles that take some science article and sneer and dismiss it.

    After a while this negative and anti-science tone becomes quite unpleasant, so I try and stay away. After all, it’s not exactly that I’m missing out on the latest discoveries and research into ID…

  11. FYI, Jerry: Ed’s scienceblogs website is now officially titled “Dispatches from the Creation Wars” instead of “Dispatches from the Culture Wars,” to indicate that the content on the old site will be more focused on science/creationism content (to reflect scienceblogs being taken over by NatGeo). Unfortunately, the new freethoughtblogs site where Ed’s full content will be feature (along with PZ Myers’) is still experiencing birth pangs.

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