I didn’t even know there was a “send prayers to Oklahoma” Twitter site, but apparently there are two. So when everyone is busy tweeting useless prayers to the injured and homeless, atheist comedian Ricky Gervais decides to actually do something. According to Yahoo! TV:
In response to trending hashtags #PrayForOklahoma and #PrayersForOklahoma, the proud atheist popularized hashtag #ActuallyDoSomethingForOklahoma, suggesting his 4.6 million followers give $10 to the American Red Cross’ disaster relief efforts.
Gervais, who reguarly spars with believers, began his growing online movement by responding to an MTV News tweet reading, “Beyonce, Rihanna & Katy Perry send prayers to #Oklahoma #PrayForOklahoma.”
“I feel like an idiot now,” he tweeted on Tuesday morning. “I only sent money.”
Gervais’ message has been retweeted 14,140 times. Predictably, however, #PrayForOklahoma is currently winning out as one of the social media site’s top-ten trending topics.
I wonder if these prayer-tweeters actually think that they’re really accomplishing anything, or merely that they get to feel they’re doing something without having to exert themselves in the least. After all, if prayerful intercession works, why did God send the tornado to Oklahoma in the first place?
I’ve given my mite, and I suggest you follow Gervais by donating to the Red Cross Disaster Relief Fund here (I couldn’t find a place to channel funds directly to Oklahoma).
h/t: Diane G.
A celebrity who knows how to get things done.
There’s something extra crazy about praying to the same god that sent the tornado.
That’s why Greek/Roman gods are more fun-competitiveness. Pit one against the other.
Plus it was fun when they got personally ticked at someone like when Odysseus blinds Polyphemus then brags about it saying his name so Poseidon, as Polyphemus’s dad, torments him by slinging his vessel all over the place.
I always think, “shut it Odysseus! Don’t say your name” at that point in the Odyssey.
Actually, it is absolutely consistent with Christian line of thinking.
God is essentially an absolutist tyrant who can kill you at a whim, and if you are not thankful enough that he killed only half of your family, he could instantly change his mind and kill the other half too.
However hard he hits you, you essentially have to thank him for not hitting you even harder.
Remember that the whole religion is built upon being thankful for god sparing them and killing Jesus instead as a substitute blood revenge.
Some insight to how the faithful deal with such issues…
http://www.opposingviews.com/i/society/video-pat-robertson-blames-tornado-victims-not-praying
That was amazing. “Don’t blame God for doing something foolish” — like living in an area — any area — which might potentially have a natural disaster. I assume you can include droughts, floods, and getting struck by lightening. Where would that not apply? Where’s the “safe” area?
You can see the two tracks of reasoning going on in their brains: the common sense one which attributes tornadoes and hurricanes to mindless, natural weather patterns … and the religious one which attributes actually getting HIT by a tornado or hurricane to failure to pray enough to God. In the first case nobody is to blame because nature is inert and doesn’t care. Exercise prudence and don’t build on a flood plain. In the second one nature does what it does because it was set up and is being used to send messages to people about their moral situation.
Confusion all around. But they apparently like it that way, since they can switch the role they play whenever it’s convenient.
Arizona, actually, believe it or not.
The only big disasters we have to worry about here are entirely caused by humans.
There’s a very big dam upstream that would submerge many many thousands of homes if it suffered a catastrophic failure, but nothing short of planned demolition or nuclear-scale weapons would cause it to fail without ample warning.
North America’s largest nuclear power generation facility is here, but I don’t see any reason to worry. They’re not the type to do the sorts of stupid things they did at Chernobyl.
We’re drawing down the aquifers and the general water table faster than the water’s being replenished, and that will likely lead to serious problems in a few decades if we don’t get our act together before then.
At the same timescale, global warming is going to make our extreme heat even more extreme, but I’m pretty sure the native and desert-adapted species will weather that pretty well, along with humans who have access to air conditioning…assuming we haven’t pumped all our water in the from of sewage to the Gulf of Mexico by then.
And, of course, there’re all the usual caveats of war and civil unrest and the like; we’re a border state, and Mexico has its share of problems, especially with the drug mafia.
But that’s all pretty low on the risk scale, comparatively, especially compared with elsewhere. We have no significant risk of earthquakes or volcanic or other tectonic activity. We’re insulated from hurricanes. Tornadoes are very rare, and ones above EF2 are practically unheard-of. We do get severe thunderstorms, but building codes are such that damage is rare and generally minimal. The worst in decades blew down a bunch of very lovely trees and damaged a bunch of cars and roofs and the like. Hailstorms sometimes but very rarely cause widespread roof and car damage. We get wildfires, but they mostly only burn down forests (which should be periodically burning anyway) and the occasional cabin or small town.
Of course we do have a pretty bad Republican infestation right now, so I suppose there’s that….
Cheers,
b&
“There’s a very big dam upstream that would submerge many many thousands of homes if it suffered a catastrophic failure, but nothing short of planned demolition or nuclear-scale weapons would cause it to fail without ample warning.
North America’s largest nuclear power generation facility is here, but I don’t see any reason to worry. They’re not the type to do the sorts of stupid things they did at Chernobyl.”
Ah Ben, such faith. 😉
The history of technology is full of things that couldn’t possibly fail. (And I’m not a Luddite, I say that as an engineer. Engineers on the whole are remarkably good at building things that don’t blow up or fall down, but on the rare occasions when they get it wrong the consequences can be dramatic).
Re the dam, I’m not sure the average nuke would worry it very much. OTOH, if it could be detonated on the floor of the lake immediately upstream, the shockwave might then do something useful (like the British ‘dams raid’ on the Mohne and Eder in World War 2) or alternatively it might blow the entire lake over the top of the dam with similar results downstream, as the landslide did at Vaiont Dam. It’s interesting to speculate.
Not that I wish a soggy end to Ben…
To be fair, in that article he’s quoted as saying, “Why did you build houses where tornadoes were apt to happen?” That’s I statement I don’t completely disagree with. It may sound harsh, but I’m also not saying it’s their FAULT they were hit by the tornado. However, it’s a risk you take in that area of the United States knowing it’s prone to some pretty harsh tornado seasons. Much like people who build their homes right on the coastline of Florida/Georgia/South Carolina; it gets hit by a major hurricane pretty much anually, yet when their house gets annihilated, they simply rebuild it and hope it’s different next year. Bit of a crazy mentality if I say so myself.
Again, are they at fault? No, I’m not saying that. Merely that it’s a KNOWN risk in the applicable areas.
It’s probably best that you don’t. People need help from all disasters, big and small. If all disaster relief donations were earmarked, the Red Cross wouldn’t be able to help people in small, local disasters. And if they got a windfall from one disaster that didn’t turn out to actually be that expensive to help people recover from, the wouldn’t be able to apply it to some other less-sexy disaster that was disproportionately expensive.
If you trust the Red Cross to help people in need (as I do — I just tossed a few pennies their way), trust them to get the triage part right as well.
b&
…and, of course, I’m sure nobody here will forget Doctors Without Borders, either….
b&
Exactly. Each person should give as they see fit, but for my part, with a country as rich as the USA I would never send ‘directed’ money there when there are many countries where that money would do far more good. Let the charity decide where the need is.
Can anyone tell me why everyone builds in wood there rather than brick or concrete? Would they not be more secure, or not? Are there no building regulations that mean people have to have secure shelters at l;east in public buildings, or have they & the tornado was just too powerful?
Rachel Maddow devoted much of her Tuesday show to the topic of shelters.
There’s really nothing you can practically do to make a home tornado-proof. The best you can do is make a shelter that’ll give you a good chance of survival. Those storms will toss full-sized busses upside-down on top of a three-story building. They’ll drive telephone poles clear through concrete walls. I wouldn’t even want to be in a heavy battle tank in an EF5 tornado. Imagine any big monster horror movie you’ve seen, such as Godzilla, and an EF5 is a real-world phenomenon that’s actually even more powerful and devastating.
A well-designed underground shelter is safe, though, especially if it’s clear of anything that could collapse into a pile of rubble that could crush the roof of the shelter. But you’d probably have to use two-inch-thick steel armor for your home’s exterior if you wanted it to survive a direct hit without damage — and no windows.
b&
Interesting – thanks Ben.
Where we you when I was in a big argument on Facebook earlier defending the people of Oklahoma for having shelters that aren’t basements 😉
This is very true. Moore wasn’t the only city to get hammered during that storm system, but as the most populous (and highest number of casualties), it gets the most attention. The same thing happened after the outbreak across Alabama in 2011 — the major cities got a wealth of media attention and donation money, while many of the rural communities that were also devastated had to beg to not be forgotten.
Actually, it doesn’t make any sense to earmark any money for a particular disaster. That would just mean that less money is used from the general fund, which is equivalent to donating to the general fund.
Ricky is pretty strident on Twitter. Really!
For ex., “Jesus loves you, but everyone else thinks you’re a right c•••.” [my redaction, not his!]
:-O
Re this hashtag, I liked this tweet, from @thewrightjamie: “Prayers don’t rebuild lost homes, people do. Get off your knees and do something useful. #ActuallyDoSomethingForOklahoma”
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Prayer is useful, if it motivates someone into action (the person doing the praying) and helps clear the mind (should I send X to Oklahoma, or should I send it to a local family that lost everything in a fire?)
But yeah, “sending prayers” sans action is pretty useless.
That’s not prayer — that’s contemplation and / or meditation.
Prayer is nothing more than a magic spell that attempts to compel, by nothing more than the force of the petitioner’s will, a more powerful entity to do the petitioner’s bidding. Even within the context of the religious story it doesn’t make any sense.
I mean, really? Jesus could do something to help these people but he won’t unless somebody prays at him? Is he not aware of what’s going on — and the prayer is supposed to call his attention to it? Is he sulking until enough people soothe his ego for him to come out of his room? Does he have his good reasons for not helping, but you’re smart enough to come up with the brilliant insight to convince him of the error his ways and spur him to action?
Insane hubris is what prayer is all about. It’s got nothing to do with planning your own actions.
Cheers,
b&
Oh Ben, you silly goose!
You know Jesus doesn’t work like that. He uses his omnipotence to motivate actual humans to do His good works. Cuz if he were to intervene supernaturally, He would prove that He actually exists and that would be bad because…ummmmm…I’m sure the reason will come to me in a minute… and also and so forth He needs to hear our prayers before He acts because, hey, He doesn’t get paid for this stuff you know, so naturally He wants a little praise from his peeps before He shows us once again how truly awesome He is!
/snark
Right on. Say it, brother. Somebody has to try to educate Ben every once in a while. Some people just cannot see the TRUTH, even though it’s right in front of their eyes.
oh… almost forgot: /snark
“but you’re smart enough to come up with the brilliant insight to convince him of the error his ways and spur him to action?”
Maybe it’s our moral superiority, not our knowledge, that is supposed to convince him. You know, God the powerful but but backward barbarian and his weaker but more refined human friends. The dialogue between Abraham and God over Sodom reads like this, and is almost comic. God says he’s going to wipe out Sodom, and Abraham asks:
“Will you sweep away the righteous with the wicked? What if there are fifty righteous people in the city? Will you really sweep it away and not spare the place for the sake of the fifty righteous people in it? Far be it from you to do such a thing—to kill the righteous with the wicked, treating the righteous and the wicked alike. Far be it from you! Will not the Judge of all the earth do right?”
The Lord said, “If I find fifty righteous people in the city of Sodom, I will spare the whole place for their sake.”
Then Abraham spoke up again: “Now that I have been so bold as to speak to the Lord, though I am nothing but dust and ashes, what if the number of the righteous is five less than fifty? Will you destroy the whole city for lack of five people?”
God says no. He then asks about 45, 40,30, 20, and finally 10. God says he won’t destroy it if 10 righteous are there. He destroys it anyway, either because he was crossing his fingers when he said this or there were not ten righteous. Anyway, the story reads like a morally superior human trying to tame the powerful but barbaric god.
I know a rabbi who’s quite fond of that story — he calls it the “horse trading” story.
I gotta give it to the rabbinic tradition. There’s some great rationalizing and storytelling that often leads to some actually enlightened conclusions. Quite impressive considering the pure shit they’re starting with….
b&
This is an important observation in general. People often confuse the 2000-3000 years of gloss that has been added to text with the text itself. Some people can tell a truly fantastic story where the text of the Bible is one thread, and the listener can come away feeling like the Bible is an amazing book when it was really the amazing story telling by generations of later people, or Handel can come along and set some of it to music and make it seem more inspiring and wonderful than it really is, etc.
I think you are confusing prayer with “thinking it over for a few minutes”.
and… sub
That is how many “think it over”; remember C. S. Lewis saying “I pray because it changes me”.
For the record: I think the idea that some deity will intervene in the events of this universe is absurd; it is even more absurd that the affairs of homo sapiens on this planet, which orbits one star about of about 100 billion in this galaxy, which is one of billions of galaxies, is too ridiculous to take seriously.
But some are calmed, comforted and inspired by prayer and so it can be helpful, so long as it is not viewed as a substitute for action, or as some sort of magic or wishful thinking.
I’ve never had much patience for the sayings of C.S. Lewis.
IMO it is useful to reserve the word “prayer” for appeals to divinities for their assistance. Given his other sayings, that is certainly what Mr. Lewis was doing, whatever changes he felt.
Contemplation, meditation, “thinking it over” are meaningful ways to describe an activity that doesn’t require any delusions but can “change me”.
I think the two interpretations of what a “prayer” is — the petition view vs. the acceptance and/or inspiration view — are often used interchangeably by the same people. When they are feeling skeptical or talking to nonbelievers then prayer is mostly directed internally towards coping or finding consolation. When that mood or situation passes then yes, they ARE asking God for favors. Then back again.
There isn’t a conflict if they refuse to see it. Nothing but harmony here. Stop being so analytical.
There is a third view of prayer — the reflexive, lip-service view. Not more than 2 or 3 hours after the tornado tore up Moore, Rep. Tom Cole, whose district includes Moore, was interviewed on NPR. When he was asked what people can or should do, He began with “First, pray.” He didn’t elabborate and then moved on to make suggestions for charitable giving, etc.
Cole has called Moore his home town, and the storm and the destruction undoubtedly were emotionally traumatic for him. But “first, pray”? It seemed like pandering from a well-trained conservative politician. Just tossing out a code word to reassure god-besotted constituents that Cole is still one of them.
I agree that it is reflexive. But that’s just a measure of how deeply engrained is the idea that magic incantations can cause deities to change their behavior. It is the automatic response of a mind practiced in religion. It is habit from a lifetime of practice.
#ThinkItOverForOklahoma
Um, thanks.
Works just as well!
I agree with blueollie on this. The prayers asking God to help may be worthless, but to many, the act of praying is akin to meditation or thinking things over. I know that when I was still religious, most of my prayers weren’t of the sort, ‘God please do this’, but rather, ‘God please give me guidance’. And in mulling over the problem while praying, often times a solution would come to me.
Still, I like Gervais’s message. Prayer is only useful if people are using it for non-godly purposes, so it’s good to remind them to do something tangible.
” ‘God please give me guidance’ ”
Those sorts of prayers are most useful to believers because you really can’t tell whether they’re fulfilled or not, unlike requests for actual help.
Prayer is useful…as a way to paper over an uncomfortable conversation. “I’m going to have open heart surgery tomorrow”. “Oh… You’ll be in my prayers.” Conversation over, if you want it to be.
In my 25 years of not being a Christian I have sometimes missed this get-out-of-jail-free card aspect of saying you’ll pray for someone. I’ll feel myself reaching for it because I don’t want to deal with the actual person and their actual problem. It has the sound of doing something, of caring, without actually having to do anything, or having to care. It keeps you from even having to think about what might help. Will they need someone to take care of them when they get back home? Could you shop for them or make them meals? Can they afford the surgery? Yuck. Those are all messy things to deal with. But luckily, you don’t have to think of any of this because you’ve played your prayer card. When you try to translate this into, say, “You’ll be in my thoughts” or something that doesn’t invoke God, it sounds more like the dodge it really is because there is no commonly accepted view of the world where mere thoughts might have any effect. Lacking the prayer card now, I have come to realize how often I must have reached for it as a simple dodge. Now I have to think, “What can I do?”, because there is no magic.
Very well put, gluonspring!
Vaal
That CAN be a part of it. But another part might be a “cheer” so to speak; sort of like when I say “good luck; I’ll pulling for you” to someone about to do a marathon, present a paper, go to a job interview, etc.
Kind words can help.
Once upon a time, when people touched wood or offered blessings after a sneeze or that sort of thing, it was sincerely believed that those actions actually had very real physical consequences — and that’s why they did them.
Now, nobody actually believes in any of those things, but the language lingers as an expression of solidarity.
The problem with prayers is that people still take that shit seriously. If “I’ll keep you in my prayers” was as untainted by sincere superstitious belief as “gesundheit” and “goodbye,” I’d probably say it all the time.
But, as it is, to this modern atheist’s ears, “I’ll keep you in my prayers” sounds as bizarre as “I’ll sacrifice a goat in your honor at Hermes’s temple that he may bear tidings of your misfortune to Olympus.”
b&
I really wish it weren’t taken seriously, because it is useful to have a general expression of solidarity that doesn’t sound forced.
“I’ll sacrifice a goat in your honor at Hermes’s temple that he may bear tidings of your misfortune to Olympus.” 🙂
I am going to use that from now on…
Augury and haruspex are more fun to pretend to practice because they are almost believable (since not as sensational as goat sacrifice). I’ll watch the flight of birds and examine the entrails of animals to ensure determine if their are good omens ahead. 🙂
Well that was a grammar fail. I’ll try again:
Augury and haruspex are more fun to pretend to practice because they are almost believable (since not as sensational as goat sacrifice). I’ll watch the flight of birds and examine the entrails of animals to determine if there are good omens ahead.
I’ll actually be sacrificing a chicken tonight. well, several, actually — I’ve got a family pack of thighs in the ‘fridge, and they’ll be unceremoniously dumped in the pressure cooker with some carrots, onions, celery, parsley, dill, salt, pepper, a splash of wine, and enough water to cover.
I anticipate I will interpret it as an omen of good meals all week long. There’ll be the soup tonight, chicken salad sandwiches, chicken pot pie, chicken noodle casserole, cold shredded chicken over chilled noodles with a Chinese peanut sauce — and that’s just the meat. The broth will go into sauces and arroz con pollo and refried beans and…
…and who says that animal sacrifice is history or somehow evil?
Cheers,
b&
Unceremoniously dumped – that’s not very sacrifice-y of you. You need to wear a robe at least when you do it!
You some kind of terrorist?
Does an old, stained T-shirt with lots of pinholes torn in the shoulders by a cat who likes to perch there count?
— and, to be fair, it’s generally the veggies and herbs and spices that get dumped…I actually have to arrange the chicken so I don’t need an excessive amount of water to cover it. I like my broth rich — it turns solid like jello in the ‘fridge.
b&
No, I’m not a trombonist — I’m a trumpeter!
Sheesh…it’s like everybody ’round here slept through Peter and the Wolf….
b&
Ha ha .. very good analysis of practical uses of saying that you’ll pray for somebody.
I agree that these application (of the actual dodge) is very convenient, and in many cases the only socially correct way to weasel out of possibility of a very awkward commitment …
Ha ha .. it is so difficult to define, yet so real. Because saying other things even like “I’ll think about it” might be unwise or downright dangerous for your future well-being. While “I’ll pray for you” is a cover all with very low risk, at the same time re-affirming your social standing.
Ha ha .. there must be a good reason why people are keep doing this for millenia, and you nail it right down.
I find it uncomfortable in the other direction because I am surrounded by relatives and friends who are theists. When somebody says “I’ll have surgery tomorrow,” it’s usually followed by “please pray for me.”. I never say I’ll pray because I don’t want to lie in this particular situation, but offer other words or means of support instead.
But do the theists REALLY believe intercessory prayers work? Or are they just asking for prayers as a kind of code word for sympathy and support. It must be the latter reason because the track record of prayers is just so awful. I’ve had many friends post about a dying relative and get tons of responses of promises of prayers and even actual prayers on the message itself, and then the relative still dies!
Ah, but their souls invariably make it into heaven.
All of the above.
Obviously they don’t really believe prayers are that effective, else they wouldn’t go to the hospital.
They are also aware of this, and often struggle to try to have a firmer belief in the effectiveness of prayer. Religious people are constantly trying to see those effects, and egging each other on to see the effects. Most sects go to the trouble to make excuses for why they have to also take practical action in the world, like going to the doctor. So they have conveniently reduced prayer down to those things that might otherwise be attributable to chance (did the chemo work or not?).
On the other hand, they’d be afraid not to pray. It definitely rises to the level of obligatory superstition that they dare not cross.
In a church I once went to I witnessed a pretty painful episode. A popular and fairly young member got cancer. This person was treated but at first the treatment didn’t seem to work. The whole church held special prayer meetings for this person and had around the clock prayer vigils. Praying for the ill is routine, of course, but this time they made a big show of really pulling out all of the stops in terms of petitioning God. At some subsequent checkup with the doctor, the tumor that hadn’t seemed at first to be responding to treatment was gone. A miracle! The whole church just couldn’t stop talking about it. They thanked God and it came up in every conversation. Sermons were preached about this proof of the power of prayer. The healed person smiled and waved. It was painful to watch. Maybe three months later, the tumor returned, with a vengeance, and she was dead before the year ended. What a deflated group of people they were for awhile. But, of course, only for awhile. They are back to praying as earnestly as ever.
Of course, whenever the effectiveness of prayer comes up, I just quote scripture:
“The prayer of a righteous person is powerful and effective.” – James 5:16
“There is no one righteous, not even one” – Romans 3:19-20
That about wraps it up for prayer, eh?
A marvelous pair of bible quotes. I must save it for future use.
I gotta get some kind of use out of 20+ years of Sunday School.
On the other hand, theists see answered prayers all the time, so I guess this offsets those rare occasions when praying for healing do not work. Example of answered prayers – a child gets accepted to a college, somebody is expecting a baby, plane landed safely, roast turkey was not burned, etc. They have such a low bar for prayers that every ordinary thing is seen as answered prayer. You’d think this was the first time sexual reproduction was ever successful in the 3.5 billion year history of life on Earth, the way they are hailing pregnancy as a miracle. Jeez!
Yes, a combination of post hoc ergo propter hoc & the old fallacy of the enumeration of favourable circumstances.
Among my younger acquaintances pregnancy wasn’t seen as a miracle, more of an “Oh shit!” moment. God’s revenge on incautious sinners, maybe. 😉
Sending “prayers sans action” is worse than useless.
It’s an attempt to rationalize inaction. “I don’t really want to part with any of my money/time, but I’m still helping!”
When the Titanic was sinking, a large group of the 3rd class passengers laid down in the hold and prayed for deliverance while being lead in the prayer by an Irish Catholic priest. The crew desperately tried to get them to the top-decks in an attempt to save their lives. They even threated to shoot them, but no avail.
Eventually the, with some of the crew looking in horror, the water finally engulfed and drowned them. Such is the power of prayer.
Now, if I were a praying man, I’d be praying the raft I built out of doors and other flotsam would hold together in a seaworthy fashion. And I’d be looking for rope to tie it tighter together in the meantime.
Here’s a secular charity without the administrative costs of the Red Cross: http://foundationbeyondbelief.org/node/1780
Administrative costs of charities – that is a good point. They look like a very worthwhile organisation.
Looks like they just donate the money to other organizations who probably do have administrative costs.
I linked to FBB from here:
http://www.patheos.com/blogs/unreasonablefaith/2013/05/foundation-beyond-belief-in-oklahoma/
This is what I call a “twitstorm”
🙂
I donate to Red Cross monthly and I completely agree with you. I see these “prayer” posts on fb every time something happens, but when it comes to giving money from there pocket, all these people suddenly disappear.
I’ll be giving a pint of blood to the Red Cross next week.
Good for you Reginald! We all should try to do that. However, be aware that if you give constantly, like 5 or 6 times a year (Red Cross says you can donate every 8 weeks), you can deplete your iron and calcium levels. It happened to me, and not only did the Red Cross not warn me, even my MD was unaware that my donations were the source of the problem. Only my Hematologist gave me the correct diagnosis.
I read that as “hemantologist” at first and thought, “well sure, I read the friendly atheist but I wouldn’t call myself a hemantologist”.
I’m half an “Easy-PZ” and half a “Coyne-head”. 😉
That was awesome when be tweeted that. I loved how he put it.
I am not totally convinced that these prayers are completely useless. While prayers won’t result in a deity bringing back the dead or repairing the devastation, the prayers will comfort those affected by the storm. Essentially, the prayers allow others to express empathy and solidarity with the survivors.
The fact that so many are comforted by a prayer to a being who would have to be responsible for the storm in the first place is a separate matter. Although, I am sure that problem can be brushed away with the fact that god is mysterious or something.
Finally, I would argue donating money does all that prayer does (at least as described above) with the added benefit of producing a tangible result.
People can be comforted by empathy and solidarity expressed in countless ways. Magic spells add nothing to the process except to fool the spell-caster into thinking that they are helping far more than they are.
Made me recall when my son (an atheist) died by suicide and people began saying they would pray for me (also an atheist)to give me strength.
What gave me strength was not their prayers, but the actions of my family & friends to support me by raising funds for The American Foundation for Suicide Prevention Out of the Darkness Walk. That’s what gave me courage & strength, because I felt we were actually making a difference.
But isn’t merely geting to feel they’re doing something without having to exert themselves in the least the basis of religion?
Donate via Oklahoma Atheists: http://www.oklahomaatheists.com/donate
If God wanted to inflict death and destruction in Oklahoma, wouldn’t sending aid be against God’s will and therefore a sin?
On another note, and I realise this may be contentious, but lets not underestimate the power of celebrity when it comes to serious issues (such as this). Ricky Gervais calling bullshit on people and actually trying to get something going is very powerful. I know the kind of people who like Gervais aren’t really going to be the church going crowd, but there are going to be a lot of people it surely influences.
Kudos to Gervais – one of the (very) few celebs, whether one likes his comedy or not, who stands up against religious bullshit.
I think atheism owes a lot to comics. Wit and ridicule are very effective.
Yes, I think you are right. Mix well read intelligent people with wit, and religion becomes a comedy goldmine.
The kudos goes to those that are not afraid to use it. In England, we have an emerging group of comedians on the TV who are not afraid to give religion a kicking. About time too – I hope things are going that way in the states too, like I alluded to in my original comment. Bill Hicks was great; Carling, Bill Maher are all wonderful, too.
I remember reading about a women who was sick and her church ladies went to see her. They talked and prayed for her,but then she said pray for me ok but do my dirty dishes go pick my kids up from school maybe stop and buy us some milk and bread. Not sure if they did any of it but the message was action not words.
“I wonder if these prayer-tweeters actually think that they’re really accomplishing anything, or merely that they get to feel they’re doing something”
Good point. Interestingly, I think it might apply nearly as well to those sending money!
That is because giving to OK disaster relief is likely to accomplish far less good than that same giving could accomplish elsewhere. For example, see:
http://blog.givewell.org/2008/08/29/the-case-against-disaster-relief/
If what you really care about is helping, rather than merely *feeling* like you are helping, then you had better make a serious effort to identify the cause where your money will accomplish the most good!
Doctors Without Borders, mentioned above, is probably a good example. Probably even better, http://www.givewell.org/charities/top-charities
Amidst the reeking miasma of god-driven journalism, it is refreshing to see that there are still people of reason willing to dissipate it. While the style and humor of Gervais is peerless, I also enjoyed this article on Slate I found in my e-mail this morning:
http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/science/2013/05/prayers_for_oklahoma_wolf_blitzer_and_other_journalists_should_leave_god.html
We need more serious journalists willing to call their mediocre coleagues out on the nonsense.
I think the bible is clear on this:
Matthew 6:5 — And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. (NIV, rev. 2011)
Thank you to all ‘Why Evolution is True’ readers for your thoughts and donations to whomever receives your kindness, whether it be the Red Cross or otherwise. We, Oklahoma, were hit two days in a row. The good people of Shawnee and of Edmond experienced a similar event on Sunday the 19th as did the folks in Moore on the 20th. There just were many , many more in Moore. Still, I know people in both Shawnee and Moore who have totally lost their homes. My home was spared only because the funnel on Sunday decided to drop a few miles beyond my neighborhood. And I didn’t have to pray to get that result. I just happened to live in a neighborhood that was in the path of the storm, but not under the funnel, so to speak.
My favorite light hearted moment from all this tragedy was Wolf Blitzer interviewing the young mother who is an atheist. I love it!
Glad you ducked the funnel. Every day here, in the protective shadow of Pikes Peak, I revel in the glory of the gorgeous and majestically tall clouds raining on us and heading out east.
Then I cringe a bit, knowing what we are sending your way.
This is fantastic!
To paraphrase Sam Harris, Christians who believe their god follows Twitter trends or answers twitter-prayers have an objectively more ridiculous belief system than Christianity. It has to be because it is Christianity plus a very ridiculous idea.
Wouldn’t that make it a very ridiculous idea squared?
Christianity is already ridiculous to the nth power.
The american red cross doesn’t seem to want my donation: there was no way of entering British Columbia on the form and my postal code is one digit to long for your zip and no way of e mailing them direct. Sigh.
Many times have I seen a form on a US site that allows you to enter in any country but only has a list of US states.
I received a package once that had my address in Australia with Alabama tacked on the end.
At least you received your package!
I live in Melbourne (airport code MLB) .. but one time, when I flew home from Europe, my luggage ended up in Australia!
(MY Melbourne – airport code MLB! – is in east central Florida, USA).
I still say the surest way to eliminate the misrouting of luggage is a law mandating that the airlines give two roundtrip tickets per bag for each location the bag gets misrouted to.
Then again, the airlines in conjunction with the TSA are doing their damnedest to ensure that nobody actually travels with luggage in the first place any more…or actually travels by air, for that matter….
b&
I’m been a Red Cross volunteer for over 10 years. It’s usually a house fire, usually a single family. I’m one of the guys who goes out, day or night, to provide disaster assistance. 95% of the Red Cross staff is volunteers.
Most people don’t know what the Red Cross does until we show up. Our goal is to provide temporary food, shelter, and clothing, and psychological support, to put people back in charge of their own lives.
Sometimes it’s a bigger event, like a tornado, effecting a lot of people, and we open a shelter. You can check for yourself the current shelter populations in Oklahoma (and Texas) with the Red Cross Shelter iPhone App (free). Because most of these people don’t have a place to go, these shelters will be up and running for longer.
Red Cross Chapters from the surrounding area and the national Red Cross headquarters were implementing their response plans before the tornado hit.
Because the Red Cross is a humanitarian organization, religion is out, and churches who volunteer their facilities as Red Cross shelters have to agree. Otherwise, no shelter there. If that agreement is violated, we walk away.
The money you send to the Red Cross is usually used locally. But sometimes ”locally” means anywhere in the U.S. Big disasters in other countries elicit a response from other governments and involve national emergency response teams, usually not U.S. Red Cross chapters. But hurricane Sandy in New York and New Jersey did receive volunteer support from Mexico.
Excellent Ray. Thank you for the outline of how the Red Cross functions, and thank you for your personal humanitarian efforts.
In a neighboring town (Tongeren in Belgium) existed a tradition that when there was a long period of drought, they turned the statue of the Mother of God with the face to the wall until it started raining. It always worked! So? 😉
A case of regression to the mean.
Droughts always end sooner of later why would you believe that the statue had anything to do with it?
On reflection I am not sure if you are being ironic. If you are please excuse my comment. (But if not, don’t).
You have given me an excellent idea for a new product. Have you ever heard of a “Dammit Doll?” I propose the Dammit Diety Doll™. Available in whatever deity you subscribe too.
Drought lasting too long? Did that tornado really mess up your town? That Hurricane cause just too much hardship? Let your deity know how you really feel about their capricious displays of divine devastation with the all new Dammit Deity Doll™
If anyone runs with this idea and makes a killing on it, please kindly forward 15% of the net profits to me.